Flashpoint: In Retrospect

[SilverHammerMan]

Now that we're gradually coming up on year since DC's regrettable Flashpoint crossover and subsequent New52 relaunch, I think it's time to take inventory of the whole thing.
Basically this is about the ideas in Flashpoint, which ones were cool, or stupid, or good, or bad, or whatever.

Now, I haven't read all the Flashpoint series, but I did read Deathstroke, Batman, Green Arrow, and Project Superman, so here are a few opinions on things that were cool ideas:
I think Flashpoint Green Arrow was pretty cool. As a one shot it was a pretty complete story and the concept (that of Green Arrow as a super-corporation that Megaman'd villains by defeating them and steal theire tech) was pretty cool. While different from the classic image of Green Arrow was certainly more interesting than the relaunched version.
Cyborg. Cyborg as America's greatest hero was quite the cool concept. Admittedly the execution might not have been great, but it was neat idea, even if they were transparently setting up Cyborg as the new token black guy on the JLA.
The Outsider was a cool idea dammit. Indian Lex Luthor with superpowers? That's awesome. And the Martian Manhunter as a sort of reverse John Carter of Mars? Also awesome.
Citizen Cold was neat too, if only because it was a cool to see a character who is normally a somewhat low level supervillain as a beloved superhero.
Deathstroke as a pirate was a fun idea and the execution was actually pretty decent, even if they did end with Slade hooking with a woman about a week older than his own daughter. But up until that there were some pretty neat concepts on the go with the superhuman trafficking and the Warlord character (remember him? with his manties and ludicrous helmet/beard combo?) as a pirate king.
Deadman and the Flying Grayson.... had some pretty nice covers. Yeah, that series kind of sucked.
Atlantis versus the Amazons was a good idea, it kind of makes me wonder if the two have ever gone to war before because it feels like such and obvious idea in retrospect.
And Flashpoint Batman was perhaps the one good miniseries to emerge from that whole debacle.

So what about you folks, what ideas did you like or dislike in Flashpoint and what would you have done differently with the whole event?

[zbg333]

(05-12-2012 01:53 PM)SilverHammerMan Wrote:  Now that we're gradually coming up on year since DC's regrettable Flashpoint crossover and subsequent New52 relaunch, I think it's time to take inventory of the whole thing.
Basically this is about the ideas in Flashpoint, which ones were cool, or stupid, or good, or bad, or whatever.

Now, I haven't read all the Flashpoint series, but I did read Deathstroke, Batman, Green Arrow, and Project Superman, so here are a few opinions on things that were cool ideas:
I think Flashpoint Green Arrow was pretty cool. As a one shot it was a pretty complete story and the concept (that of Green Arrow as a super-corporation that Megaman'd villains by defeating them and steal theire tech) was pretty cool. While different from the classic image of Green Arrow was certainly more interesting than the relaunched version.
Cyborg. Cyborg as America's greatest hero was quite the cool concept. Admittedly the execution might not have been great, but it was neat idea, even if they were transparently setting up Cyborg as the new token black guy on the JLA.
The Outsider was a cool idea dammit. Indian Lex Luthor with superpowers? That's awesome. And the Martian Manhunter as a sort of reverse John Carter of Mars? Also awesome.
Citizen Cold was neat too, if only because it was a cool to see a character who is normally a somewhat low level supervillain as a beloved superhero.
Deathstroke as a pirate was a fun idea and the execution was actually pretty decent, even if they did end with Slade hooking with a woman about a week older than his own daughter. But up until that there were some pretty neat concepts on the go with the superhuman trafficking and the Warlord character (remember him? with his manties and ludicrous helmet/beard combo?) as a pirate king.
Deadman and the Flying Grayson.... had some pretty nice covers. Yeah, that series kind of sucked.
Atlantis versus the Amazons was a good idea, it kind of makes me wonder if the two have ever gone to war before because it feels like such and obvious idea in retrospect.
And Flashpoint Batman was perhaps the one good miniseries to emerge from that whole debacle.

So what about you folks, what ideas did you like or dislike in Flashpoint and what would you have done differently with the whole event?

I distinctly remember when the internet was abuzz with Flashpoint concepts, CA ran a feature talking about cool places they could go with it. Specifically, the Batman one had some interesting questions. What is Alfred's relationship with Batman? How does Batman's methods and ideology change? What villains result from the birth of THIS Batman? And then, imagine my surprise when the story we get is just "this Batman KILLS. Because he's an adult. And SPOILERS FOR A YEAR OLD STORY! It reeked of shock moments. "You know Oracle? At least she had arms! CatOracle can't even move her neck! We're extreme! Gordan dies! Batman's wife is the joker and they make out, and then she dies! Kids killing people! EXTREME!"
It just bothered me because it isn't a good story if you aren't already familiar with the Batman characters. If you don't know Oracle and Catwoman and Renee Montoya, then the shock of seeing those characters in worse situations is meaningless. It's like a Who's Who of Shitty lives. But people seem to like it, so what do I know?

[Maxy Barnard]

Seems to me that it had Secret Invasion syndrome. The main comic and primary tie-ins (aquaman and wonder woman) were kinda terrible, but most of the minis were good. Especially Frankenstein and Secret Seven. In fact maybe just those two were good, but the rest were at least above average.

*looks at post about Batman above*
Okay, maybe not Batman

[Koltreg]

I liked the Outsider, Frankenstein, Green Arrow and what I read of Project Superman. I'd honestly be happy to read continuations of those series as opposed to what is currently going on (minus Frankenstein which pretty much got a partial continuation).

Of course Gorilla Grodd, Secret Seven, Legion of Doom and the main series were horrible.

I think DC has a hard time seeing what it's good assets are (though those don't necessarily sell well).

Overall though, I got some of those awesome badges and some for series that I didn't even buy and that may be my favorite thing to come out of Flashpoint.

[Name]

I read Frankenstein and jack all else. I liked it. And I got the Frankenstein, Deadman, and Deathstroke badges.

[SilverHammerMan]

I think that we can all agree that the buttons may have been the single best idea to emerge from Flashpoint. Personally I didn't get any of the buttons at the time, but a few months back I did pick up the Batman button (because Batman) and the Legion of Doom button (both because it looked cool and because if anyone ever gets the reference I'll know that they're a big enough nerd to be my friend).
I would love some more buttons.

[BIGREDROBOT]

(05-15-2012 07:54 AM)SilverHammerMan Wrote:  I think that we can all agree that the buttons may have been the single best idea to emerge from Flashpoint. Personally I didn't get any of the buttons at the time, but a few months back I did pick up the Batman button (because Batman) and the Legion of Doom button (both because it looked cool and because if anyone ever gets the reference I'll know that they're a big enough nerd to be my friend).
I would love some more buttons.

I would argue that the buttons were the only good thing to come out of Flashpoint.

I have to say, sitting in on the Flashpoint panel while waiting for the Grant Morrison panel to start at SDCC last summer was the single most depressing thing I saw that trip. And that includes that morbidly obese Bob Fett. Just some horrifically bleak stuff.

[Name]

I still say the Frankenstein mini was good.

[MoustachePants]

Things I enjoyed about Flashpoint:
Buttons (and beating horses)
Frankenstein (still beating)
Those Deadman and the Flying Grayson Covers (beating with pictures!):

The idea behind and some of the execution of Project Superman (surely it must be dead by now?)
Ditto Thomas Wayne Batman (dead)
and the idea behind the new S!H!A!Z!A!M!

I know I'm going to get grief for this, but I thought the idea of having 6 orphans and a tiger banding together to bring out a big hunk of superhero was actually a cool way to rethink the Marvel family. And as quickly as it was cool it was brutally murdered to no effect. So yeah I guess that idea was awesome and then got its proverbial hand cut off by the hand that penned it.

Other things that were horrid:
They killed Booster Gold. Booster had been made into a really solid character by Johns from Infinite Crisis until he left the solo title after about a year, if memory recalls correctly. Rememder and Jurgens did an OK job afterwards, but Johns made Booster was fun again, and he had new levels of depth with the 'Protector of the Time Stream' gig and the cocky hero cover story. And they killed him and made him the one dimensional slop he is in JLI now because, "there's no more multiverse or time travel in the New 52."[sic]

12 issues of Flash that was like reading someone running in place (boo) waiting for something to change everything so Barry didn't have to be one dimensional any more. Or from another angle so they could wipe out and hopefully make everyone forget that Flash: Rebirth happened. (Tin foil hat alert: Is the entire New 52 just Johns' way of making people forget how badly he bollocksed that up...)

Everything involving Aquaman and Wonder Woman. Granted I didn't read them all (read: any) outside of the main miniseries, but my goodness that was enough to make me wince.

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Addition: Does anyone else find it funny/horrifying that there is a yellow brick road from, "Still Only $2.99us CHEAP!" that leads straight to, "Who Lives? Who Dies?"